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 Vigilante, EZDYNAMICS, and the redemption of Macphisto 
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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 7:10 pm 
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Location: Maple Grove
Aceq2jot wrote:
I am sorry but if you look at the prices for a permit class you will see Bills is asking $150 but you have to take the intro to handguns pre req which is $94 so using my math skills that put the price at over $244 which is what i paid to sit in a class with 10 other peeps.
I took a course at Bills a month or so ago, and there was no prereq. Cost me $150.00 + another $100.00 for the app fee + 26 days waiting on the good Sheriff at Hennepin County.

Not promoting Bill's at all, just wanted to convey my experience.


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 7:39 pm 
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Eratosthenes wrote:
Aceq2jot wrote:
I am sorry but if you look at the prices for a permit class you will see Bills is asking $150 but you have to take the intro to handguns pre req which is $94 so using my math skills that put the price at over $244 which is what i paid to sit in a class with 10 other peeps.
I took a course at Bills a month or so ago, and there was no prereq. Cost me $150.00 + another $100.00 for the app fee + 26 days waiting on the good Sheriff at Hennepin County.

Not promoting Bill's at all, just wanted to convey my experience.
Just to be clear, if you had a good experience at Bill's, saying good things about the class and the instructor you took your class from is not only permitted, but encouraged.

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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 7:45 pm 
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Eratosthenes wrote:
Aceq2jot wrote:
I am sorry but if you look at the prices for a permit class you will see Bills is asking $150 but you have to take the intro to handguns pre req which is $94 so using my math skills that put the price at over $244 which is what i paid to sit in a class with 10 other peeps.
I took a course at Bills a month or so ago, and there was no prereq. Cost me $150.00 + another $100.00 for the app fee + 26 days waiting on the good Sheriff at Hennepin County.

Not promoting Bill's at all, just wanted to convey my experience.


I had a Jt as my instructor for both classes and i was happy with the experience. On thier website it says that you need the intro class, which was good for me as i had never fired more than a Air rifle.

But in was saying that a smaller intimate setting may be better for some people, who may have never been around any weapons before. But Jt made the class a lot of fun.

And i will say i learnt a few things at the steel shoot a couple of weeks ago from all the friendly advice peeps were giving. I am looking forward to learning more next time around :D


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 8:02 pm 
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Location: St. Paul, MN.
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

That will learn me to be in class all day..........look at all the action I missed.

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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 8:16 pm 
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We gladly accept gratuities, y'know :D

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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 8:30 pm 
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macphisto wrote:
joelr wrote:
plblark wrote:
Look at Macphisto. Several here had issues with him. Yet just a couple days ago I saw 3 people amazed to agree with him and I've read a few good posts from him recently.
Absolutely. Mac came pretty close to being permanently JohnMEricksoned, but it's been months and months since I've had any reason to be concerned about him, and he's become a definite plus to the Forum.

The kind words are appreciated. It certainly feels much better to be recognized for being good than for being bad. In my first few months here, I came off as a jerk and an idiot. It was only because of the considerable patience of Joel, Andrew and the other mods as well as the wave of criticism I received for some of my posts that I was able to step back and reconsider my opinions, attitudes and how I present them. People don't change overnight, but they certainly can change over time; I'm proof of that and happy to still be around.


good for you. :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu May 10, 2007 8:44 pm 
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macphisto wrote:
The kind words are appreciated. It certainly feels much better to be recognized for being good than for being bad. In my first few months here, I came off as a jerk and an idiot. It was only because of the considerable patience of Joel, Andrew and the other mods as well as the wave of criticism I received for some of my posts that I was able to step back and reconsider my opinions, attitudes and how I present them. People don't change overnight, but they certainly can change over time; I'm proof of that and happy to still be around.



FREAKIN EXCELLENT POST 8) 8)

Welcome Macphisto


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 5:46 am 
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EZDYNAMICS wrote:
Well my rank is CPL which stands for Corporal- E4 and my base was Quantico Sentry, Virginia and served in Afgan. You see the mind of a killer is complex and different then yours, Have you ever killed someone? Coming from someone who HAS killed people and the effect it has on your mind is hard to imagine. Someone going into target wanting to kill, will feel power, like no one can touch him and its a huge high for him to kill people and the last Fu**in thing he's going to expect is someone shooting back at him, because that would bring down his high of power. I hope you all understand that and please dont hate me for my words be a man and learn that wanting people banned for making a opinion different than yours, shows your threated by me in some odd way.

S: If you cant handle my words and want me banned, how are you going to handle some bad guys bullets?

So you are a killer huh - I doubt it very much - if you had done what you said you had done - you would not talk about it here.

I think that it is time that you and I sat down for a beer so that I could explain what we are all about there. Hell I will even buy - you pick the spot.

Differing opinions are great - but making statements meant to inflame - and using language that paints 2A rights and RKBA in a bad light is nothing that we need help with - especially in a public forum.

Not the kind of help that we need. Your opinions are wanted - your bullshit is not.

Pm me EZ - I will gladly meet you for a beer and have a chat with you.


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 9:51 am 
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joelr wrote:
EZDYNAMICS wrote:
Hey Joel I have a question for you? Why is your course $175, I was thinking of taking it but my wallet says to go with a $125 class, yours is the highest out there ive seen. You you explain that for me, Thanks

Look, since you obviously want to tick me off enough to get yourself locked out, you can go ahead and do it -- just pick another way; inquiries as to my prices don't bother me at all.

The reason I charge $175 is that I'm worth it. I think so; the market agrees. You can find many good classes for less -- some for far less -- and many inadequate classes for less, as well, as I'm the most expensive instructor in the state. I'm quite literally the worst choice for people who either choose to or have to think with their wallet.


When I got started, someone pointed me to this forum and to Joel's book. I read the book and was impressed with its handling of the issue, the depth of coverage, and the presentation style. When it came time to take the class, I chose Joel. The money was a big consideration but so was the quality of instruction, the other things he's done related to Carry in MN, and his presentation style. It was the best class I've ever taken on any subject.

That being said, I would not hesitate to recommend several instructors here to family and friends. In fact, I have already done so. 2 friends got their permits. One with Joel, one elsewhere. I have 2 family members looking at a class with Ttousi soonish and another 2 friends interested in one of Phorvick's classes.

That's not to leave anyone out, it's just the people from here I've met whose styles and schedules and prices meshed with the people I was recommending them to. I've tried to give each person a few references and then point out the strong points of each option for the individual I'm talking to.

We have a great group of people here. They're a great reference and even betterpeople. Thanks guys and Gals!


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:12 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2007 12:56 pm
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Location: champlin
EZDYNAMICS,
I am new at posting here, but have been reading for quite some time.
the advise that alot of Senior members are giving you is a reflection of
how much effort they have put into fighting for you to be able to get a permit to carry and there knowledge of what amo the ati's will use to make there arguments more effective.
How you feel emotionaly about a situation like this is probably more common than you think, but we still have to choose our words in public
wisely because the fight is on going.
just my take on things; correct me if I am wrong?


read and react and hopefully make the right choice.

18 days and counting.


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:14 am 
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macphisto wrote:
joelr wrote:
plblark wrote:
Look at Macphisto. Several here had issues with him. Yet just a couple days ago I saw 3 people amazed to agree with him and I've read a few good posts from him recently.
Absolutely. Mac came pretty close to being permanently JohnMEricksoned, but it's been months and months since I've had any reason to be concerned about him, and he's become a definite plus to the Forum.

The kind words are appreciated. It certainly feels much better to be recognized for being good than for being bad. In my first few months here, I came off as a jerk and an idiot. It was only because of the considerable patience of Joel, Andrew and the other mods as well as the wave of criticism I received for some of my posts that I was able to step back and reconsider my opinions, attitudes and how I present them. People don't change overnight, but they certainly can change over time; I'm proof of that and happy to still be around.


Mac as one of the people who bounced on you quite a bit I have to compliment you on your change in attitude and outlook. It says alot to me about the type of person you are/have become that you could take this hard of a look at yourself and make the changes you wanted to.

I don't know if you are interested but there a number of fun shooting events games that a number of us participate in that you might enjoy. IDPA, the steel shoots organized through the forum etc, if you are interested let me know and I will see what I can do to get you involved.

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"For those who fight for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."
-Unknown

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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:23 am 
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EZDYNAMICS wrote:
Well my rank is CPL which stands for Corporal- E4 and my base was Quantico Sentry, Virginia and served in Afgan. You see the mind of a killer is complex and different then yours, Have you ever killed someone? Coming from someone who HAS killed people and the effect it has on your mind is hard to imagine. Someone going into target wanting to kill, will feel power, like no one can touch him and its a huge high for him to kill people and the last Fu**in thing he's going to expect is someone shooting back at him, because that would bring down his high of power. I hope you all understand that and please dont hate me for my words be a man and learn that wanting people banned for making a opinion different than yours, shows your threated by me in some odd way.

:?:PS: If you cant handle my words and want me banned, how are you going to handle some bad guys bullets?


Well, my rank was Chief Petty Officer (E-7) and I served in the 1st gulf war and had to do many things I chose not to talk about except among friends.

BTW I am glad that the mind of a killer is totally different than mine. I took no pleasure in the things I had to do while there.

To clarify I don't want to have you banned because your opinion is different than mine, I welcome a different opinion. The way you express it and the apparent glee you take from comitting acts of violence is what bothers me.

Also to the best of my knowledge thare is no military base called Quantico Sentry. Additionally don't bother to try to lecture me on the mind set of a killer.

As to not being able to handle your words it is definitely not a case of being able to handle it but rather chosing not to. I think you would be wise to accept Pinnacle's invitation, perhjaps you might learn that often times those who talk about it haven't done it and those who don't talk about it have been there and done that and even got the t-shirt.

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MN DNR Certified FAS Instructor
NRA Pistol, PPITH, and PPOTH Certified Instructor
IFIA MCPPA Certified Instructor

"For those who fight for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."
-Unknown

Honorably Discharged member of Uncle Sam's Underwater Canoe Club.


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 2:56 pm 
On permanent time out
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Location: My mother's basement, St. Paul MN
jac714 wrote:
EZDYNAMICS wrote:
Well my rank is CPL which stands for Corporal- E4 and my base was Quantico Sentry, Virginia and served in Afgan. You see the mind of a killer is complex and different then yours, Have you ever killed someone? Coming from someone who HAS killed people and the effect it has on your mind is hard to imagine. Someone going into target wanting to kill, will feel power, like no one can touch him and its a huge high for him to kill people and the last Fu**in thing he's going to expect is someone shooting back at him, because that would bring down his high of power. I hope you all understand that and please dont hate me for my words be a man and learn that wanting people banned for making a opinion different than yours, shows your threated by me in some odd way.

:?:PS: If you cant handle my words and want me banned, how are you going to handle some bad guys bullets?


Well, my rank was Chief Petty Officer (E-7) and I served in the 1st gulf war and had to do many things I chose not to talk about except among friends.

BTW I am glad that the mind of a killer is totally different than mine. I took no pleasure in the things I had to do while there.

To clarify I don't want to have you banned because your opinion is different than mine, I welcome a different opinion. The way you express it and the apparent glee you take from comitting acts of violence is what bothers me.

Also to the best of my knowledge thare is no military base called Quantico Sentry. Additionally don't bother to try to lecture me on the mind set of a killer.

As to not being able to handle your words it is definitely not a case of being able to handle it but rather chosing not to. I think you would be wise to accept Pinnacle's invitation, perhjaps you might learn that often times those who talk about it haven't done it and those who don't talk about it have been there and done that and even got the t-shirt.



http://www.quantico.usmc.mil/
Most people dont talk about it but i do, talking gets rid of the pain inside.

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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 3:10 pm 
On time out

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chinakay wrote:
We gladly accept gratuities, y'know :D


Let me talk to the wife ;) She controls the purse strings :D


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 3:33 pm 
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EZDYNAMICS wrote:
[http://www.quantico.usmc.mil/
Most people dont talk about it but i do, talking gets rid of the pain inside.


I know there is a base at Quantico, but a sentry is someone who guards something not a military installation.

I would buy that except most people I know talk to qualified therapists not on-line forums.

In case you have not figured it out I am not convinced.

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MN DNR Certified FAS Instructor
NRA Pistol, PPITH, and PPOTH Certified Instructor
IFIA MCPPA Certified Instructor

"For those who fight for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."
-Unknown

Honorably Discharged member of Uncle Sam's Underwater Canoe Club.


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