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 Carrying in a car (for non-permit holders) question 
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 Post subject: Carrying in a car (for non-permit holders) question
PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:11 pm 
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The way I have understood it up to now, the Minnesota statute boils down to this --

"To transport in a motor vehicle, snowmobile or boat if the firearm is unloaded and in a closed and fastened case, gun box or securely tied package."

--and yes, I realize that's not a sentence. Anyway, it's actually from the summary of the law on the NRA-ILA website. Yet, on another forum, there's an insistence that the container has to look like it's intended to carry a gun. And a lot of the discussion (as usual) claims that it also has to be in some rear portion of the vehicle.

As I understand it, the NRA-ILA version is corrrect, but I don't know how to look it up in Minnesota Statutes to be sure.

Can anybody point me in the right direction?

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:27 pm 
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Here's the answer, full of bloggy goodness:

Transporting a firearm in your car in Minnesota

Quote:
In and out of my <a href="http://www.mngun.com/">Minnesota Permit to Carry a Pistol class</a>, I get asked quite a bit about the laws concerning transporting a gun in your car.

If you have a carry permit, and it's a handgun,and you're in Minnesota, the answer is easy: you can legally have the handgun on you, near you, or anywhere in the vehicle, and it may be loaded or unloaded at your discretion.

But what if you don't (yet) have a permit? First, it's time to <a href="http://www.mngun.com/register.asp">register for a class</a>. :) Then, read this:

The carry law, <a href="http://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/statutes/?id=624.714#stat.624.714.9">Minnesota Statute 624.714</a>, pertains only to handguns:

<blockquote>Subd. 9.Carrying pistols about one's premises or for purposes of repair, target practice.

A permit to carry is not required of a person:

<...>

(5) to transport a pistol in a motor vehicle, snowmobile or boat if the pistol is unloaded, contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, or securely tied package.</blockquote>

Oddly, while a gun wrapped in newspaper and tied with twine is probably in compliance with this law, one in a fastened purse is not:

http://tinyurl.com/mnguntransport

<blockquote>STATE OF MINNESOTA
IN COURT OF APPEALS
C5-98-1180

State of Minnesota,
Respondent,

vs.

Phyllis Eugenia Taylor,
Appellant.

Filed May 18, 1999
Affirmed
Willis, Judge

Hennepin County District Court
File No. 97070100

<...>

S Y L L A B U S

The statutory exception to the requirement of a permit to possess a pistol in a motor vehicle that allows an unloaded pistol to be carried in a “case” refers to a gun case and does not extend to a purse.</blockquote>

You can <a href="http://tinyurl.com/mnguntransport">read the whole thing</a>, of course.

Long guns are governed under a Minnesota hunting law, <a href="https://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/statutes/?id=97B.045
">Minnesota Statute 97B.045</a>:

<blockquote>A person may not transport a firearm in a motor vehicle unless the firearm is:

(1) unloaded and in a gun case expressly made to contain a firearm, and the case fully encloses the firearm by being zipped, snapped, buckled, tied, or otherwise fastened, and without any portion of the firearm exposed;

(2) unloaded and in the closed trunk of a motor vehicle; or

(3) a handgun carried in compliance with sections 624.714 and 624.715.</blockquote>

A common misconception among law enforcement and gun shop commandos is that the gun must be in the trunk or the rear of the vehicle. The source of this confusion is a federal law, the <a href="http://law.justia.com/us/codes/title18/18usc926a.html">Firearms Owners' Protection (sic) Act of 1986, 18 USC 926A</a>, which provides "safe passage" immunity from state and local law while you're just passing through:

<blockquote>Sec. 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or
regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person
who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting,
shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a
firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully
possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully
possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the
firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being
transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the
passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in
the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver's
compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked
container other than the glove compartment or console.</blockquote>

That federal law is a protection against local laws. It does not bind localities to its provisions. Minnesota offers the same protection regardless of the location of the unloaded, cased gun.

There are some more subtleties to cover: blood alcohol content, the presence of prohibited persons and those without carry permits, and the meaning of "carry" and "public place," but I need to save <i>something</i> for next time.

Have any questions? Visit <a href="http://www.mngun.com">Minnesota Gun Training by Andrew Rothman</a> and ask!

Hat tip to author Dave Matheny for asking this very good question most recently, at my favorite firearms forum, <a href="http://www.twincitiescarry.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11723">Forum.TwinCitiesCarry.com</a>.

_________________
* NRA, UT, MADFI certified Minnesota Permit to Carry instructor, and one of 66,513 law-abiding permit holders. Read my blog.


Last edited by Andrew Rothman on Sat Feb 07, 2009 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 12:27 pm 
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Thanks for the useful info, Andrew, bloggy or not.. I'll add your blog to my regulars.

I had begun a medium-length reply when I clicked the back button to refer to something in the orginal post, and then, when I clicked back ahead, made the charming discovery (one I seem to have made on this site before) that doing that wipes out everything you have written. (My compliments to the designer. Who wants to be able to keep what he has just written while he looks at something else?)

Anyway--

This sounds like one judge interpreted a statute one way, and would I be right in thinking that another judge might look at the same statute differently? Does this one interpretation hold a lot of weight?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 1:58 pm 
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Dave Matheny wrote:
I had begun a medium-length reply when I clicked the back button to refer to something in the orginal post, and then, when I clicked back ahead, made the charming discovery (one I seem to have made on this site before) that doing that wipes out everything you have written. (My compliments to the designer. Who wants to be able to keep what he has just written while he looks at something else?)


That's a function of the browser, not the site. Switch to Firefox.

And when you hit reply, you can see the thread below the entry form. :)

Dave Matheny wrote:
This sounds like one judge interpreted a statute one way, and would I be right in thinking that another judge might look at the same statute differently? Does this one interpretation hold a lot of weight?


Because it's from the Minnesota Court of Appeals, yes, it is binding on all district courts and the court of appeals itself. It would take the MN Supreme Court to reverse that decision.

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* NRA, UT, MADFI certified Minnesota Permit to Carry instructor, and one of 66,513 law-abiding permit holders. Read my blog.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 3:36 pm 
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Andrew Rothman wrote:
Dave Matheny wrote:
I had begun a medium-length reply when I clicked the back button to refer to something in the orginal post, and then, when I clicked back ahead, made the charming discovery (one I seem to have made on this site before) that doing that wipes out everything you have written. (My compliments to the designer. Who wants to be able to keep what he has just written while he looks at something else?)


That's a function of the browser, not the site. Switch to Firefox.



Yep, Firefox I can go back several screens and then back to what I was typing to post and it will still be there.


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