http://www.startribune.com/16075672.html I just read this on the Star Tribune website. This is absolutely crazy.

Imagine how that guy's demeanor would've changed if she hopped out with a gun in her hand.

That's an interesting scenario...she may have felt that she was in immediate danger, feared great bodily harm, but I don't think she would have fulfilled the all of the "pillars". She shouldn't have stopped...the fact that she stopped may not have made her appear as a "reluctant participant".

I agree she shouldn't have stopped especially with kids in the car. I wasn't even saying that she would have been legal to shoot. I'm just saying with crazys like that guy you might want to get your wife of children's mother a permit and a gun.

This is why I tell my loved ones never to stop for anyone*, under any circumstances, but to call 911 instead. It's far better to live another day to wonder what was going on than to be thrown to the coyotes and wolves (quite literally, in some cases).

Pretty much everyone gets the cell-phone treatment by them now.

I myself never render aid without at least my SW 637 on my hip, covered by a light jacket; I never stop for someone wildly gesturing, honking, flashing headlights, driving aggressively, etc... (unless I'm witness to an accident or missing a passenger after my last stop for gas or whatever).

*Aside from the police (except in certain circumstances, where suspicion that the "officer" may not actually be an officer).

[Edit to add:] You know, at first I thought the perpetrator of this particular crime might be a co-worker of mine. He's got a documented criminal history of agressive driving behaviors, and has threatened several of my co-workers (as well as me) with violence in the past for percieved insults and slights.

After reading the description, though, I know it's not him.

I've been meaning to write an essay on this for ellegon.com ; just haven't gotten around to it. You've given me an excuse.

In reality, though, you can't get your wife -- or anybody else -- a carry permit; they have to do it themselves. You can't make many people do much of anything; Abe Lincoln and the Army of the Republic settled that some years ago.

I don't just mean that in a technical sense; I know a fair number of folks (all men, so far) who have very much wanted a loved one (usually a wife, girlfriend, mother or daughter, but in one case a son and in another case a father) or a friend to get a carry permit and carry routinely or under special circumstances to protect themselves.

They can't make them do it. Nobody can. And my own observation is that the harder they push, the harder the resistance. Pushing doesn't work; they can't do that successfully. You can't do that successfully.

What you can do is make an offer. That's worked some of the time. (Not all; sorry. No guarantees.)

Here's one offer -- and while it's oriented toward TCCarry and me, I'm sure that there's no instructors around who wouldn't be happy to do the same, or something similar.



At that point, take a yes or a no gracefully; if yes, head off to the websiteand sign up. If no, just shrug and say something like, "okay; the offer's still open."

Folks can always change their minds.

I've been through this a few times. The only time it gets complicated is when the family member/girlfriend has no firearms experience.

Then we can't just go do the range qual after class (I know there are instructors who will; I won't), but have to arrange some basic training (either the evening B2C session, Basic Pistol with Roger and Sue at BPR, or something less formal, depending), and then do a shooting qual later on.

Want to pitch that at someone? Fine by me. Up to you.

Just don't push.

Good to hear. That is exactly what I was contemplating telling my girlfriend when I signed up for my upcomming refresher training.

That's similar to what I do, except I only ask to be paid if the spouse ends up doing the qualification and wants the certificate.

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"In reality, though, you can't get your wife -- or anybody else -- a carry permit; they have to do it themselves."


I agree. Maybe I should have said "time to talk to your wife about the benefits of legally carrying a firearm". I think it goes without saying that a kind and considerate person doesn't badger or coerce people into their point of view; they present the facts.[/b]

Soon as she pulled out her cell phone to dial 911, she would be a reluctant participant in my book. Pulling a gun would be completely justified and shooting the perp.

My wife and I have a standing understanding never to pull over to the side of the road to "talk to someone" who might be a nut case. She can destroy her car to get away from someone and will head to a police or fire station for help.

I sure hope they find this ass hat and make an example out of him.

Sure.